proofreading in English

[laura]

Hi friends,
would you please give it a look and see if there are any errors? Suggestions and corrections are welcome....
Thanks in advance
P.s. It may also be a new topic of discussions.....

Latin and Europe
I think all the European states should have a common language. Every European citizen, native of a country member of the EU or not, has always felt this need, but now times are mature to solve the question. As you may well remember, Finland, during the six-month period of the European chairmanship, tackled the problem and tried to solve it by adopting Latin as official language of the country. I think that the new entries of the EU would be happy of this choice, rather than see their own national and cultural identity crushed by the overwhelming influence of English or French. In the Eastern Europe Latin is still a living language and many people are able to write and speak it correctly, in Leetonia in particular. No United Europe will be possible if the present linguistic Babylonia will persist. Latin only will make all feel part of a common place. Latin only can render us Europeans: is a feeling shared by millions of persons, much more than it seems.


Finland did not adopt Latin to communicate with the member of the EU or during the European assemblies of its ministers. It used it symbolically and jokily. Just try to imagine a discussion at the Brussels’ or at the Strasburg Parliament. Their members’ interventions would be full of foreign words, especially English words that do not have their equivalent terms Latin. Don Antonio Bacci, a catholic Cardinal since 1960, in 1944 published an extraordinary Lexicon eorum vocabulorum quae difficilius latine redduntur, enlarged many times in the following years. There are many Vatican prelates able to translate into Latin the encyclical letters of the Pope, as well as other important documents of the Holy See. But instead of using simple words, currently used in every country, such as computer, airplane, missiles, mobile telephone, chip, digital television, satellite dish, are forced to make use of interminable, intricate and baroque periphrases.

The defence of Latin is a noble and courageous battle, but I do not notice the linguist Babylonia you mention in your letter. As the rest of the world, Europe as well, has a common language. English is the language of the diplomacy, of the commerce and finance, of the scientific research. We are all aware of the fact that the hegemony of the English language confers a great advantage to all English-speaking countries. And we also know that the overwhelming diffusion of English in the international communication plays a negative role on the vitality and the diffusion of the great national languages of single countries. The linguistic revolution, as you wish in your letter, seems to me impossible for two main reasons.

Firs, English, willy-nilly, has unified the world and makes possible a continuous exchange of information and notions, with no precedent in the human history.
Second, the use of English has not been imposed, with a decree or something like that. Its fortune in the world is not only due to the fortune of the British Empire or to the supremacy of the USA over the last 2 centuries. It is the result of a spontaneous and reasonable choice made by millions of people, fascinated by the prospective of broadening their contacts, experiences and knowledge, thanks to a vehicular language that makes all this reality.

[MC-Force]

Latin and Europe
I think all the European states should have a common language. Every European citizen, whether they be a native, a member of the EU, or not, has always felt this need, and the times may be mature enough now to answer this question. As you may well remember, Finland, during the six-month period of the European chairmanship, tackled the problem and tried to solve it by adopting Latin as the official language of the country. I think that the new entries of the EU would be happy with this choice, rather than see their own national and cultural identity crushed by the overwhelming influence of English or French. In the<-- remove Eastern Europe Latin is still a living language and many people are able to write and speak it correctly, in Leetonia in particular. No United Europe will be possible if the present linguistic Babylonia will persist. A single language will make people feel united. Latin only can render us Europeans: is a feeling shared by millions of persons, much more than it seems. <-- Not sure what you mean.


Finland did not adopt Latin to communicate with other members of the EU or during the European assemblies of its ministers. It used it symbolically and jokingly. Just try to imagine a discussion at the Brussels or at <-- remove the Strasburg Parliament. Their members’ interventions would be full of foreign words, especially English words that do not have their equivalent terms Latin. In 1944, Don Antonio Bacci, a catholic Cardinal since 1960, published an extraordinary Lexicon eorum vocabulorum quae difficilius latine redduntur, <-- Is that the title of the book? Maybe you should italicise it enlarged many times in the following years. There are many Vatican prelates able to translate into Latin the encyclical letters of the Pope, as well as other important documents of the Holy See. But instead of using simple words that are currently used in every country, such as computer, airplane, missiles, mobile telephone, chip, digital television, satellite dish, they are forced to make use of interminable, intricate and baroque periphrases.

The defence of Latin is a noble and courageous battle, but I do not notice the linguist Babylonia you mention in your letter, as the rest of the world, Europe as well, has a common language; English. English is the language of the diplomacy, of the commerce and finance, of the scientific research. <-- remove underscored words We are all aware of the fact that the hegemony of the English language confers a great advantage to all English-speaking countries. And we also know that the overwhelming diffusion of English in the international communication plays a negative role on the vitality and the diffusion of the great national languages of single countries. The linguistic revolution, as you wish in your letter, seems to me impossible for two main reasons.

First, English, willy-nilly, has unified the world and makes possible a continuous exchange of information and notions, with no precedent in the human history.
Second, the use of English has not been imposed, with a decree or something like that. Its fortune in the world is not only due to the fortune of the British Empire or to the supremacy of the USA over the last 2 centuries, it is the result of a spontaneous and reasonable choice made by millions of people, fascinated by the prospective of broadening their contacts, experiences, and knowledge, thanks to a vehicular language that makes all of this a reality.

[sv]

"In the Eastern Europe Latin is still a living language and many people are able to write and speak it correctly, in Leetonia in particular."

Remove it. It's nonsense. In Eastern Europe people do not speak Latin and it's as dead there as everywhere. In Lettonia (Latvia in English), people speak Latvian (Lithuanian in Lithuania). These are Baltic languages. This is a language group of Indo-European language family. They are far from Latin and closer to Slavic languages.

[Sisyphe]

"In the Eastern Europe Latin is still a living language and many people are able to write and speak it correctly, in Leetonia in particular."

Remove it. It's nonsense. In Eastern Europe people do not speak Latin and it's as dead there as everywhere. In Lettonia (Latvia in English), people speak Latvian (Lithuanian in Lithuania). These are Baltic languages. This is a language group of Indo-European language family. They are far from Latin and closer to Slavic languages.

As student in indo-european and specially Latin linguistics, I can confirm that finnish and baltic scholars, and even their students, belong to the best experts for latin litterature and philology at present time. Didine remind us herself newly that there is a Latin-speaking radio station in Finland. Although Estonian and Finnish are ural-altaic tongues, and althoug lettish and latvian are, indeed, very far from slavic or italic groups.

Therefore, claiming that "latin is still an living language" could be a little overstated, but Laura's speech does be right. I wish french students and pupils of highschools spoke Cicero's language as their northerly colleagues do .

[ Once more, sorry for my English...]

[didine]

Although Estonian and Finnish are not ural-altaic tongues, and althoug lettish and latvian are, indeed, very far from slavic or italic groups.

You probably meant "although Finnish and Estonian are not INDO-EUROPEAN tongues and although Latvian and Lithuanian are".

By the way, the Ural-Altaic theory is not considered as being relevant anymore.

[didine]

Didine remind us herself newly that there is a Latin-speaking radio station in Finland.

Actually they haven't gone as far as that. There are just news in Latin once a day or so on one of Finland's public radio stations.

[Sisyphe]

Although Estonian and Finnish are not ural-altaic tongues, and althoug lettish and latvian are, indeed, very far from slavic or italic groups.

You probably meant "although Finnish and Estonian are not INDO-EUROPEAN tongues and although Latvian and Lithuanian are".

Ups... Corrected yet.

[/quote] By the way, the Ural-Altaic theory is not considered as being relevant anymore.[/quote]

Well... I have heard something like that newly. But, you know Didine, linguists are very fickle people : they always want to say the exact opposite of what previous scientists said ; so... Anyway, the concept of "ural-altaic group" is still in use in common books, at least for the indo-europeanists.

[laura]

Well, the question of Latin and its usage in Europe has raised a nice discussion.
What about a forum in Latin?
Maybe the idea is a little bit crazy and if Cicero knew it, probably would turn in the grave!!!!
But, in spite of all, it would be funny!!!!!!

[Beaumont]

What about a forum in Latin?

Maybe not a whole forum, but a topic would do.

[sv]

As student in indo-european and specially Latin linguistics, I can confirm that finnish and baltic scholars, and even their students, belong to the best experts for latin litterature and philology at present time. Didine remind us herself newly that there is a Latin-speaking radio station in Finland. Although Estonian and Finnish are ural-altaic tongues, and althoug lettish and latvian are, indeed, very far from slavic or italic groups.

Well, i just live in Latvia and am not sure cause of it, if we speak it or not. Maybe lots of us speak Latin. OK. I have to go out and ask people if they speak Latin in any way.

Now seriously, to say that many people in Eastern Europe still speak and write Latin is the same as to say that many people e.g. in Australia still speak and write Latin. Some (scientists and doctors) do, but no more than anywhere else. The situation with it is absolutely the same as everywhere. It's non-local dead language from "somewhere out there". Where do we come in?

I agree, local linguistic school is nothing but former Soviet linguistic school. So it could be impressive.

The problem is just that Latvian often has an abbreviation Lat, and the words themselves sound rather close to each other to people who don't know both Latin and Latvian (especially when they use German variant of the name - Lettonia), that can cause such mistakes.

[Sisyphe]

Well, the question of Latin and its usage in Europe has raised a nice discussion.
What about a forum in Latin?
Maybe the idea is a little bit crazy and if Cicero knew it, probably would turn in the grave!!!!
But, in spite of all, it would be funny!!!!!!

Latine loquarisne, Laura ?

Re vera, si tu vis me topicum aperire, in quo latina lingua utamur, hoc enim ego facere possum. Sed timeo, ne pauci consortes ejus fori latinam linguam intelligant... Mihi quidem, quamvis hanc magnopere studeam, perdifficilime videor, aliquid dicere in lingua illius Ciceronis...

Sed, tantum ad ridendum, cur non...

Well, i just live in Latvia and am not sure cause of it, if we speak it or not. Maybe lots of us speak Latin. OK. I have to go out and ask people if they speak Latin in any way.

Now seriously, to say that many people in Eastern Europe still speak and write Latin is the same as to say that many people e.g. in Australia still speak and write Latin. Some (scientists and doctors) do, but no more than anywhere else. The situation with it is absolutely the same as everywhere. It's non-local dead language from "somewhere out there". Where do we come in ?

I should confess that I never putted even one foot in baltic states... And I do not know anything about the ratio of students within baltic population, and those of classical students in baltic colleges. It is often said that they were higher than in other european or american universities. But as we say in France : "l'herbe est toujours plus verte dans le pré du voisin" (grass is always greener at neighbour's meadow). However, seven or eight percent are not "everybody", I agree.

So, for quantity, I cannot say anything. But for quality, I am sure. Except their complicated names ( ), baltic and finnish linguists are very performant.

(However, Latin is nowhere "living language". My grant-uncle, who was vicary of the catholic church, thougt, when he went to Italia, that one could get by with Latin in Roma ! He asked someone for the "via Garibaldi", but "via" in Latin means "street", whereas in Italian it is "road" - so he got lost, far from Roma, in some expressway !)

[laura]

Bona dies, Sisyphe!
Ego etiam latine pauce loquor, sed mihi videtur tu linguam latinam melius scire. Ego linguam latinam schola studiabam et malo in hac lingua fari, quamvis etiam mihi hoc difficillime videtur.
Hic et nunc, ego "Memoriae imperatoris Hadrianus" lego. Scis tu hoc liber?
Quod cogitis?
Vale!

[Sisyphe]

Bona dies, Sisyphe!
Ego etiam latine pauce loquor, sed mihi videtur tu linguam latinam melius scire. Ego linguam latinam schola studiabam et malo in hac lingua fari, quamvis etiam mihi hoc difficillime videtur.
Hic et nunc, ego "Memoriae imperatoris Hadrianus" lego. Scis tu hoc liber?
Quod cogitis?
Vale!

In order to avoid off-subject (???), we follow here :
Ad digressum vitandum, hunc continuemus :

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